Christian post’s claim untrue, Dungpa

An article posted on the christianpost.com site said that a Dungpa (sub divisional officer) Pema Wangdi manhandled an independent Christian Pastor Pema Sherpa on July 30.

This has however turned out to be a lie after The Bhutanese conversed with both the parties and eye witnesses.

The recent border quandaries had prohibited people residing in border areas especially in Sarpang from conducting meetings and gatherings for the security reasons.

In this regard the Gelephu Dungkhag office had disseminated public notifications not to conduct any kind of meetings. And for emergency purposes it should be approved by the administration.

However on July 30 the Dungpa received a report from the Gup saying that four Christian pastors with 35 cohorts each had gathered for a religious ceremony in Gelephu.

After receiving the information, the Dungpa visited the site and tried to convince the pastors with the valid points.  Pastor Kinga and Rajesh Sangrula apologized and said that they will conduct religious meetings only within their families and left the site.

However the two other pastors Ganga Bdr. Rai and Pema Sherpa could not be convinced.

“If anyone wants to conduct such huge gatherings, they should first get approval from the Administration.” Gelephu Dungpa, Pema Wangdi said. “They violated the notification from the government.”

He said Pema Sherpa declined to end the ceremony and said that the Dungpa can ‘report it to anyone’.

“The Christian post has exaggerated the incident and I did not even mention anything about the religion,” the Dungpa said.

Contrarily the pastor said the Dungpa grabbed him by the chest and threatened him with his Patang (ceremonial sword).

“I don’t see any harm in organizing such religious gatherings,” Pastor Pema Sherpa said in a phone interview. He said the Dungpa did not mention anything about the religion but asked him to dismiss the crowd.

Pastor Pema Sherpa said he was aware of the ‘notification’ but the gathering was a religious one, and everyone has the right to practice religions of their choice.

“Therefore I could not digest what the Dungpa told me,” he said.

Dungpa Pema Wangdi said when he was trying to wear his patang the pastor might have mistaken it as an attempt to use it on him.

The incident was also witnessed by some local government officials.

“They only exchanged words and I did not see the Dungpa hitting Pema Sherpa,” said Gelephu Gup Tashi who was present at the site.

According to the Dungpa the security and safety of the public has become a priority after the recent unfortunate incident in which a Royal Bhutan Army (RBA) soldier was ambushed by armed assailants.

Pastor Pema Sherpa has submitted a letter of apology in which he stated that he will not repeat such a thing again.

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50 comments

  1. These ‘pastors’ are nothing more than cult leaders. Bhutan and any other community needs to be careful before things get out of hand. The US is full of nuts like these and are themselves having problems.

    • apkado, I have some advice for you, dont make this issue a diplomatic. how can you say US is full of nuts. There is a saying that a man with red eye see all things red. I just feel that you are nut so you see all things nuts.

  2. We don’t know for sure what had happened. Whatever we know is through the media. Whatever the truth may be, we must practise tolerance and respect all religions as it is enshrined in our Constitution. Whoever this ‘Apakado’ is must know that when one of his fingures are pointed to others, the other four fingures are pointed to himself. I would likely recommend not to post hatred comments on the website. Because Buddhism teaches us to abstain from bad thinking, bad speech and bad action.

    • how many fingers do you have, 5? sorry, I have only 4 plus 1 thumb which is also pointing forward.

    • i always find this to be a funny joke whether people talk about fingers pointing forward and backward…lol!

    • Because Buddhism teaches tolerance, love and compassion the missionaries take undue advantage of it. Don’t you think so? Because we do not have Buddhist fanatics, people from other faith take advantage of it and literally coerce and lure people to get converted. 

  3. APkado has nothing good to say about anyone

    • you want me to say something about christian cult nuts, like the ones who lynched a woman in Samtse? You must be a nut.

  4. I am with apkado

  5. I support apkado.

  6. when you have freedom to choose religion, you dnt mean it by influencing people and encouraging. 
    Hey Pastor, the Dungpa  has said for the security reason and i dnt know if your religion teach you to bark at the officials when he is concerned about the security.

  7. Apkado! In every religion there is a cult and occult. Christianity is not the religion that has committed a mistake somewhere in Samtse 2-3 years ago. It does not mean that all the pastors practice a cult. It is unfair to stick and generalize everything. If you are qualified and great reader you should not make a immature comments. This will not only bring a division and hatred in multi-faith country like Bhutan. I know Bhutan is a birth place of GNH and in such a place there should not be religious bais which is not at all the vision of our great leader 4th King of Bhutan. You have not understood the definition of GNH. GNH is not particularly for Buddhist but it is also for all faiths who practice in different religion. God Bless you.

    • my statements will only bring divisions? You must be talking from the wrong orifice. It is these cults that have even split families. Mothers and fathers not talking to their kids, living in the same house eating separately. Why? It’s not because of a religion, it’s because the way it is being taught. New converts are taught to hate buddhism and hinduism and view them as the teachings of the devil. 

      Yes in every religion there may be a cult, and yes christianity has so many cults it is difficult to generalize anything. But the fact is that most of the so called pastors are paid recruits from one cult or the other mostly from the USA. They have deep pockets to pay people to come and attend service. These are all facts. Where is this money coming from? It’s as effective as a sitting fee for board meetings. Everybody comes, even if to just sleep through the meeting.

      Buddhists are usually extremely tolerant. But christianity has evoked a sense of alarm among many because of the intolerant teachings that these pastors are passing. 

      And let’s not talk about GNH. The christian pastors certainly know nothing about GNH. For them it’s all about jesus christ and whatever version of what he said that is convenient to them that they believe in.

      • Apakado,

        how can you say that Christian pastor don’t know about the GNH? Are they not the citizens of Bhutan? Ok you explain what is GNH.

      • whether we know GNH or not GHN is for every citizens of the country but you went saying that Christian do not know the term GNH that is wrong conception. You please tell me on what perspective are you defining the term GNH? You have generalized everything started condemning everyone that is that comments my friend!

    • Hi Kota, Religion is the one which we have to follow what was followed by four fathers. We cant buy and sell religion. If you are a faithful and dedicated you should follow what is followed by your parents. Theses days why do people join some other religions,this not beacuse that they like that religion it is beacuse that they give lot of benefits to incourage more peoples to join them. But who are those peoples join them, Most are drivers and low income peoples. Now if you try to listen from them most of them are regretting. As far as I am concerned this paratice should be controlled by law unless if it is not by birth.

      • Agey Haap, if you talk of benefits, then why do you think many temples are being established in western world. Don’t you think it is also for benefit’s sake?

        • Kota, first try to learn who has built those temples and for whose benefit. The temples were built by community/country of that religion and now to have more followers they give lots of benefit to new comers. Otherswise what is the point of people converting their religion. As this things are new to Bhutan its is becoming a issue within famalies and relatives and out govt.must look into the matter.

      • Hi you: No religion in Bhutan is its own. Buddhism was originated from Nepal where Buddha himself was Hindu, Hinduism was originated in India, and Christianity was originated in Jerusalem. Analysis truly.

        Moreover, if our parents and grand parents were right, why on earth we had to bring so many changes…why not remain the same. In the same way, what our parents did, we cannot do the same. May be your are doing…are you.

        Dirty mind always brings chaos, not the peace. For such, we need to invent anti-dirtymind Virus scanner.

        THINK GOOD FOR GOODNESS OF ALL

    • Multi-faith? Don’t you think it lead to communal riots and chaos? Did you in the first place even try to understand what Buddhism really is before you got converted to Christianity simply for materialistic gains?  

  8. Apkado is very much rite, i am with him

  9. Hi Apakado, may I humbly request you to be little more generous and decent in your writing. You seem to be thinking that you already have the complete truth and knowledge of everything. Please don’t take me otherwise; for I am arguing or debating with you; because my intention is not to win, neither to hurt nor to harm anyone, but to sow a seed of harmony! So good luck to you.

  10. if we had christians like those in Darjeeling, the sane type, I don’t think any Bhutanese would mind because many Bhutanese grew up in Darjeeling. But what we have in Bhutan are the lunatics like the ones who beat that old woman to death in Samtse. We do need to be worried.

  11. Beating to death is not only christian but there are in every religion, have you not read in the papers, wife mudering husband and husband mudering wife is very common, those unfortunate people too are from different communities and faith. He/she may be Buddhist, Hindu , Christain and others sects. For this we cannot he is from Buddhist faith / Christian and start condemning that is fair comments

    • you’re talking about apples and oranges. husbands and wives killing each other is common. But the case in Samtse was about a woman being killed on the instructions of a pastor.  and even the kids of the woman participated in it. very cult like.

      • You are saying, it was done on the instruction of a pastor. Are you giving comments based on the paper you read or have you personally interviewed the particulat pastor. If it were on the instruction of a pastor – what is the law doing? This is not a fair comments.

      • Solaris ! No religious leader/ Pastor/ Preist/ Lama will order to kill living human being. If he or she is enlightened leader. An Illuminated leader/Pastor/Preist/ Lama will never take such step in the case of Samtse it will come under ignorant. For which you can say Pastor is cult and promoting the cult. That’s wrong comments. you have cited that I am talking about the apple and orange on what perspectives have you interpreted apple and orange?

      • yes no enlightened leader will cause harm. And that is exactly my point. The cults posing as christianity are cults and their leaders are insane and have not understood the teachings of brotherly love. Instead they have adopted the evangelical intolerance of modern day cults who spend millions trying to convert lawfully or unlawfully. Plus they are idiots. Which led to the death of that woman in samtse and of course lots of strife within families where one or two members have been converted and will not tolerate their old family practices. 

  12. I don’t think it is the matter of religion. It is about security issue esp. after the ambush attack in the south of Bhutan. At times like this we have to observe the security measures.

    • I dont’ see why these pastors have any basis to complain about discrimination. Their entire teaching is discrminatory against other religions. What rights do they want when they dont’ respect the rights of people to follow their own religions. They pump in money and convert one family member and cause much misunderstanding within the family. 

      These pastors need a thrashing. All you need to do is send a potential ‘convert’ with a hidden video camera to record what they do during their conversion services and you will have proof that yes, all pastors need a good thrashing. Or we should simply throw all our laws out.

      • Solaris! before making your none sense comments on pastors, why don’t you visit the Chamgang jail to interview the people who were involved in the act and know the fact for yourself. They will tell you what was happened during that time. God forgive you!

      • sorry buddy, but ti is you guys and the pastors who need forgiveness from your god. you guys are cheap, deceitful, cunning, materialistic, and petty. You are causing social strife in our society and even in families. 

        I’m sure your friends in Chamgang must be busy trying to convert all the other prisoners and maybe even the prison guards with sweet words and promises of money. 

        this cult phenomenon is dangerous as it takes advantage of the weaknesses in each individual by promising greatness. Usually neurotics do well in the cults. and other people with financial woes  or health concerns. 

        Someone who had migraines was told he had a heart condition which would improve if he converted. It turned out he had seizures and wasn’t being treated because he had converted. When he wanted to leave the cult, he was told that now he had converted if he left he would die. This is how they take advantage of our vulnerable citizens. 

  13. apkado, you are talking of families being split because of christainity, perhaps you are least aware of the children who are the victims of broken families. There are illegitimate children born to so many women without the proper identity of a father, the father seeking the second wife and the mother the second husband. The families are spilt here. WOuld you say now, that Buddhism also splits or atleast that the moral values does not work? Or would you now humbly admit that split in the family is non religious cause, at least this is not true to christianity. 

    • great, now why don’t you blame all the ills of the world on buddhism. Why stop at split families? corruption, rapes, robberies, stabbings etc. Buddhism must be at fault according to the christians cults. that is how they convince themselves of always being on the right.

      • After reviewing of each one’s comments. I have evaluated that how immature we are ! And we know how to blame each other and with this blaming game we will not reached any where. we Bhutanese needed reconciliation and healing may be christian, Buddhist or Hindu. No amount of argument will bring transformation in the society Bhutan needed love and compassion not hate. Bhutan is not the country only for Buddhist Christian/ or Hindu its for all faiths being practiced by the citizens. The noble Vision of 4th Druk Gyalpo is inclusive society which he defines GNH and thus he becomes protector of all religions. This one of the elements of GNH

      • Yes, Bhutan is a country for all faiths. So why is it that the Christians are so intolerant of people who have been Buddhists for dozens of generations and keep trying to convert them to these new fangled cults? Their intolerance is worse than the islamists because at least the islamists let you lead your own lives.

        That is the source of all the problems. Live and let live and there will be no social strife. 

        • Solaris, the problem is being created by your nonsense comments not Christians. Christians never make any comments or judge other people. What have been writtten so far is answers for your questions. You should have the same attitude of Prevail.

        • I don’t want to particularized this comments rather I wanted to make very generic and I don’t want to make negative comments as I have cited in my previous comments. No amount of hated will bring solution but we can always look for the solution. As I have said, in every religion there are fanatics and we can never seperate the postive and negative it was there in the past its in our todayness world and will there in forthcoming. Simple overview of fisherman’s son. Fisherman’s son was hated by many teachers because of habit of sleeping in the class. Once the head of the teacher made research why this boy is having habit of sleeping especially in the class hour. As a query to head teacher he had discovery boy father being fisher man the boy was assigned by his father to accompany in night fishing and many times boy did not have time sleep was the habit of sleeping in the class. Like wise , we may have to find out motive behind fanatic or intolerance before we pass verdict failing to that, our negative endorsement could be inaccurate.

  14. I will definitely lobby to amend the constitution in future. It must say, “Buddhism shall be the state religion while people may choose to practice any faith”. 

  15. antiSycophants

    Man it is already there. Know your own constitution before writing such comments. No wonder your posts are always self centered,blind,ignorant.

  16. Prevail, are you sleeping in your own world? Your fisherman story is the story of real life and we have similar stories in our own schools of kids doing funny stuff. If you look into their lives you will find that their families and split of having affairs or even being criminal. That’s how kids learn.

    So now if you ask why the christian missionaries are being fanatics, the only explanation is that they are cults. Real christians don’t spend their lives bothering other people about their religious beliefs. But the evangelical ones are the ones who just can’t live happily knowing there are other religions in the world. They get a lot of funding to convert people to christianity and many of these ‘commando missions’ are here in Bhutan doing precisely that..

    If they just believed and did what they believed in, it would be one thing. But in this case, they are very well funded by their source organizations mostly in the USA. For example http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=2176&dat=20071213&id=RBclAAAAIBAJ&sjid=zxIGAAAAIBAJ&pg=1607,3682746

    Where does all this intolerance to other religions come from? It comes from a narrow interpretation of the Bible which was never intolerant. But today most new christians are learning from fanatics to be intolerant and this is why we will have major problems in Bhutan if we don’t recognize that these people are not believers but fanatics. 

    • solaris ! May be you’re citation concerning about me may be partiallly true becuase I needed to be update myself but still I feel am in the cycle of samasara people like you must come and liberate those unliberated groups. May be some one who keeps on changing the faith we cannot condemned them directly becuase they may be searching truth.For this we must asked questions ourselves why people are changing the faith? May not be for some small incentative. if there faith is totally basis on some benefits then they are in wrong path.That I am with” YOU”. Kingdom of God is never for eating and drinking but its for the rebirth in Heaven. if some one is making road to heaven then its not wrong. Rather we have to encourage them for this pilgrimage.One thing before I conclude I will appreciate you for your postive comments not just using harsh sentences saying these and that

  17. What citation of you did i make?

    Yes, some people change religions because they are searching for some answers. But the vast majority of people are not. The struggling farmer or domestic helper are not on any soul searching quest. All they want to do is make ends meet. When these people suddenly change religions, especially to christianity, you can bet your ass they have received some incentives.

    Religion is not just a relationship with god. It is also a party of society and family and culture. You change religions and a lot of things have to change, especially one as intolerant as the new-fangled christian cults. 

    My ‘harsh’ words have nothing to do with anything except the social discord these pastors are sowing. Our government does not have the confidence to take action as per the laws because of the fierce backlash they will get from christian funded organizations abroad, but in my opinion they should. They need to call a spade a spade and let these organizations prove their case if they want.

    • Everyone today seems to speak about right to freedom. What is freedom?????? Freedom is a matter of choice. It is up to the individuals how he or she wants to live his life, But the moments too much of leeway is provided it might become detrimental to the interests of society. We should not forget that as we live in a society.
      More you get freedom more you become selfish. For example look at the people from our neighboring countries. How they have become selfish? They are indifferent towards their neighbors and other members of their society; even people do not know names of their neighbors. They do not want to help one another at the time of need. They think they are living their life peacefully and have nothing to do with other families. They forget their duties towards society and nation as a whole. 
      If we give freedom to a small boy and let him do what he wants, then he can’t be a good citizen for sure and we can’t expect that also, because if we don’t teach him something he will get nothing and he will keep on doing whatever he likes to do. Let’s not create complex society wherein we don’t realize that “people from many different religious backgrounds can cause a wave of violence that might result in the loss of over thousand lives.”

  18. kota, sorry but the problems are not caused by my ‘nonsense comments’. My comments are in reaction to what the cult leaders are doing in Bhutan. Stop that and my comments will stop.

    • All religious institutions have a tendency to foster bigots, false teachers and cults. This is not a phenomena only to Christianity. Let’s face it, if there are people who become pastors with mercenary objectives then there are also lamas/monks/khenpos/gurus who, in the name of eastern mysticism, have attracted many donors from the west! Given the opportunity no Bhutanese, regardless of their religious belief, will shy away from the lure of money.

    • Sorry Pema, please don’t compare apples and oranges. This seems to be a typical problem in Bhutan.

      All religious faiths have conmen. If you want to call the Lams going donors conmen go ahead. But even if they are, they are like the ordinary criminals who are just after money. If there is something that is WORSE than an ordinary criminal, it would be people like these cult leaders who are trying to create social change. What they will succeed in doing is creating social chaos. That is much worse.

      They don’t need money because their church sponsors from the US are giving them money to do their dirty work. Money is no problem for them. They want much more and they need to be stopped.

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